Table of Contents

April 2025 - Dadavani - English

EDITORIAL

Interference and Its Effects Stop by Remaining in the State as the Knower-Seer

When You Become Chandubhai, There Is Negligence

All That Needs to Be Done Is to See, in the State as the Knower-Seer

The Knower-Seer, Through the Intellect or the Self?

The One Who Knows Everything Is the Knower-Seer

By Finding a Solution, the Function as the Knower Disappears

If You Do Not Interfere, There Is No Attachment and Abhorrence

Chandu Feels Remorse, You Keep Knowing Him

The Karmic Account Is Cleared by Seeing

Suffering Arises From Sitting in the Wrong ‘Seat’

Have Conversations With ‘File’ Number One

Clearing ‘File’ Number One

The Body Is an Object to be Known and You Are the Continuous Knower

Upon Becoming the Knower-Seer, Interference Ends

Keep Seeing the Discharge

The Traffic of Circumstances Causes a Lapse in Seeing

To Be the Knower-Seer of the Prakruti Is Considered Conduct as the Self

Be the Knower-Seer by Sitting in the ‘Seat’ of the Pure Soul

Past Karma Are a Hindrance to Remaining as the Knower-Seer

That Which Does Not Interfere in the Unfolding Karma Is Called Gnan

Besides the State as the Knower-Seer, Everything Is Interference

The Discovery of the Tirthankar Lords

The State as the Knower-Seer Through the Practice of the Five Agnas

The Keval Gnani Continuously Remains in the State as the Knower-Seer

To Continue Prevailing in the Present Is Itself Keval Gnan

The Knower-Seer Is Not Liable for the ‘Foreign’

To Not Enter the Parkshetra Is Adeethh Tapa

From the State as the Purush, Purusharth and Parakram Begin

The State as the Knower-Seer in Swakshetra Is Actual Purusharth

In the Function as the Knower-Seer, the Self Remains Separate

Upon Realizing Who You Are, Eternal Bliss Prevails

Eternal Bliss Arises in the State as the Knower-Seer

Nothing Needs to Be Done, One Simply Needs to See

Clean Your Own Wheat Grains

www.dadabhagwan.org

April 2025 - Dadavani - English

Interference and Its Effects Stop by Remaining in the State as the Knower-Seer

EDITORIAL

What is the essence of Akram Vignan (the spiritual Science of the step-less path to Self-realization) in brief? It is that ‘I am indeed the pure Soul; I am the Knower-Seer only.’ And whatever is happening in one’s life is simply the discharge of previously filled stock of karma, and One has to keep Seeing that. Besides the jagruti (awakened awareness) of ‘I am pure Soul,’ whatever is emptying out is nothing but the discharge of the filled stock of karma, that itself is charitra moha (discharge illusory attachment). To See and Know (jova-janvanu), that itself is Gnan (Knowledge of the Self), whereas becoming engrossed in the filled stock of karma is dakho-dakhal (interference and its effects caused by the ego in the unfolding karma). To lapse in Seeing and Knowing is the exact instrument for measuring dakho-dakhal.

Mahatmas (Self-realized Ones in Akram Vignan) often ask, “We try to See by remaining as the Knower-Seer, but in that moment, it feels as though we are seeing through the intellect.” In response, absolutely revered Dadashri says that You are the Seer of what the intellect is seeing. The intellect can know everything that is perceived through the sense organs, whereas the Self Knows and Sees the antahkaran (the internal functioning mechanism in every human being composed of the mind, intellect, chit, and ego complex). How can One discern the activity of Gnan (Knowledge of the Self) from the activity of the intellect? When there is dakho-dakhal in the unfolding of karma, it signifies the presence of intellectual knowledge (buddhi gnan) and when there is no dakho-dakhal in the unfolding of karma, it signifies the presence of the Knowledge of the Self (Atma Gnan).

If Chandubhai is doing something right or wrong with someone, or getting angry, then You are the Knower-Seer (Gnata-Drashta) of Chandubhai! If Chandubhai is eating, drinking, or bickering, all of that is charitra moha; You should keep Seeing it, so the moha (illusory attachment) continues emptying out. If any form of suffering arises, Know that You are seated on the wrong ‘seat’; ‘This is not My seat.’ So You should get up from that ‘seat’ and come sit on the ‘seat’ of the pure Soul. This Vignan (spiritual Science) is doing all the work, so there is no need for You to get perplexed in this world. Now, whatever entanglements arise in the antahkaran, You should not become engrossed in them. ‘You’ should become so strong that, no matter what kind of karma unfolds, You remain in Swakshetra (the realm of the Self), You remain seated in the ‘cave’ of the pure Soul and keep Seeing; do not step out [of the ‘cave’] at all!

What is the essence of this entire Gnan? If You have already come to Know the Real, then the relative is subject to scientific circumstantial evidence. So just keep Seeing whatever is happening. Do not interfere at all. After attaining Gnan, if One does not lapse in remaining as the Knower-Seer, then He is not responsible for the ‘foreign’ [relative] at all. Despite this, mahatmas often feel a deep regret because the state as the Knower-Seer does not remain continuously. It keeps coming and going, coming and going. To explain this, absolutely revered Dadashri says, “The karma of worldly life are still pending, and they need to be cleared, don’t they! As these ‘files’ decrease, the laksh (awakened awareness) will remain more and more!” The ardent prayer is that all of us mahatmas recognize the interference of the intellect in the unfolding karma, commence the Purusharth (Real spiritual effort) to remain in the state as the Knower-Seer, and always remain in Parmanand (eternal bliss).

~ Jai Sat Chit Anand

Interference and Its Effects Stop by Remaining in the State as the Knower-Seer

When You Become Chandubhai, There Is Negligence

Questioner:Dada has given bhed Gnan (Knowledge that separates the Self from the non-Self); He has separated us. ‘I’ am separate, the Self is completely separate, but Chandubhai still remains, doesn’t he? He is going to remain for however many years he is destined to remain, isn’t he? Chandubhai, the pudgal (the non-Self complex), will remain, won’t it?

Dadashri: It will remain; that pudgal will remain. ‘You’ have surrendered the pudgal. Now the pudgal is subject to vyavasthit (the result of scientific circumstantial evidence). It will keep functioning according to its vyavasthit. ‘You’ should keep Seeing that. ‘You’ should keep Seeing what that pudgal is doing. This is Your Purusharth (the Real spiritual effort to prevail as the Self).

Questioner: ‘I’ should keep Seeing the pudgal, but should ‘I’ also occasionally caution the pudgal or not?

Dadashri: Yes, You should caution the pudgal! But when he lapses into negligence, then You should caution him.

Questioner: Oh, he lapses into negligenceall the time.

Dadashri: No, it is the unfolding of karma that makes him do all this. However, You should go around with Your ‘eyes’ open and with vigilance, that is all. That [understanding that the unfolding karma makes him do all this] should not be misused. Otherwise, Your jagruti (awakened awareness) of Seeing will become dim. If You See, then there is nothing else to be done. The One who remains in the Agnas (five directives that preserve the awareness as the Self in Akram Vignan) is indeed Seeing Chandubhai, so He does not need to be told anything. But if He is not Seeing, then You have to caution Him.

Questioner: You had spoken about jagruti, about remaining in jagruti and continuing to caution, that is what we are discussing here.

Dadashri:Yes, that is correct. For the One who is able to remain as the Knower-Seer (Gnata-Drashta), there is no need for this explanation. Whereas for the One who is not able to maintain jagruti, we tell Him, “Go about with Your ‘eyes’ open and do not become negligent.” Nevertheless, vyavasthit is going to run everything, but still, there should not be any negligence. And for the One who remains as the Knower-Seer, there is no negligence, nothing goes awry. That is what You are accountable for. ‘You’ are the Knower-Seer of what Chandubhai is doing.

Questioner: So Dada, does that mean that in any situation, instead of Seeing Chandubhai [as separate], if ‘I’ become Chandubhai, is that considered being negligent?

Dadashri: Yes, that is what is meant by having become negligent. In any situation, instead of Seeing Chandubhai, if You become Chandubhai, that is negligence. Whereas what ‘we’ are saying is to go about with Your ‘eyes’ open in these situations.

Questioner: Yes, but sometimes the ‘eyes’ open after it happens. Dada cautions [within], ‘This has happened, now start Seeing it.’

Dadashri: Yes. That is why ‘we’ have said to stay with Your ‘eyes’ open there. ‘You’ should maintain that jagruti. That ends up happening, doesn’t it? Dada does not have to [physically] come to tell You, does he? It’s the Science that’s at work. ‘You’ do not have any kind of problem. It’s at work naturally and spontaneously. It even cautions You! People [mahatmas; Self-realized Ones in Akram Vignan] say, “We are not able to experience the Self.” Hey mortal one, does the Self not caution You from within, all day long? They respond, “Yes.” So that, in itself, is the Self. Who else would come [to caution You]? Is it some outsider who has snuck inside?

All That Needs to Be Done Is to See, in the State as the Knower-Seer

So what is the first stage as the Knower-Seer? To simply See ‘What is happening in this world!’ ‘You’ do not need to do anything else, You just have to See it.

If You keep Seeing ‘What is happening,’ it means the Self has become separate.

Questioner: I wanted to ask a little about the state of the Knower-Seer. Is it necessary to remain as the Knower-Seer in a solitary area as opposed to a crowded place like at home or outside? Is there any benefit in that?

Dadashri: Actually, that is called an entanglement. To See whatever is happening is called Gnan (Knowledge of the Self). It is not in Your control, is it! The desire may be there that, ‘It would be nice if it were like this.’ But that needs to happen, doesn’t it?

The karmic stock that you had filled, it is due to that karmic stock that this dakho-dakhal (interference and its effects caused by the ego in the unfolding karma) is happening! Whereas another person may not have such filled stock, so he would not have any dakho-dakhal. There is no dakhal (interference effects caused by the ego in the unfolding of karma) of any sort in ‘us’. ‘We’ simply remain as the Knower-Seer.

Questioner: Please provide a definition for dakho-dakhal. What is the exact ‘thermometer’ to measure dakho-dakhal?

Dadashri: To keep Seeing is not considered dakho-dakhal. To See and to Know is not considered dakho-dakhal.

The Knower-Seer, Through the Intellect or the Self?

Questioner: Even when ‘I’ am trying to See as the Knower-Seer, ‘I’ feel as if the seeing is happening through the intellect.

Dadashri: What you are saying is correct. It is indeed the intellect that is seeing. The [Real] Knower-Seer actually begins from the point that even the intellect cannot reach.

In stating, “I am making an effort to see as the knower-seer,” as you are saying, “I am making an effort,” that means it is definitely the intellect. Now, when the controlling influence is of the intellect, then it seems as if the intellect is seeing at that time; however, the One saying this is Gnan. It is You who Saw this. ‘Seeing’ means You cannot be considered to have Seen as the Knower (Gnata), but You Saw this as the Seer (Drashta). When can it be said that One has Seen as the Knower-Seer? When You feel ‘it seems that way’, You are Seeing as the Seer and when You ‘come to Know it’, then You have Known it as the Knower. Were You the Seer or did someone else come to See?

Questioner: But it feels as if the one who says, ‘It feels that way,’ is indeed the intellect talking.

Dadashri: That is not the intellect. The intellect is involved in seeing, meaning the intellect sees from over there, and You are the Knower of what it is seeing, such that, ‘It is definitely the intellect that is seeing, I am not the one who is seeing.’ Therefore, the One who is Seeing the intellect is You. So there, You are functioning as the Seer. So You have figured out who the Seer is. Meaning, this Seeris definitely functioning!

Questioner: But I cannot seem to go beyond the intellect. So is this seeing only being done while remaining in the intellect?

Dadashri: No, You have been able to go beyond the intellect for sure. But the intellect still continues to get nourishment. It is due to certain causes that the intellect gets nourished, which in due time will slowly diminish. Besides, You have been able to go beyond the intellect, otherwise, the intellect would not let you come here every day.

Questioner: Whenever the intellect interferes even a little, ‘I’ tell it, ‘Sit aside. I will go to Dada for sure. Let go of it!’

Dadashri: Yes, so You tell it, ‘Let go of it!’

Questioner: The intellect does not interfere with regard to coming to Dada; it comes along just fine, fondly.

Dadashri: The fact that it’s coming along fondly is indeed the sign that this Gnan has gone beyond the intellect. It’s Pragnya (the direct liberating light of the Self) that’s at work.

It is the intellect that is seeing this, but You feel in the mind that, ‘I am seeing’; that is the illusion (bhranti). The knower-seer of all these gneya (objects to be known) does not seem to be the ‘I’, but it seems to be the intellect. But who is the Knower-Seer of this intellect? The Self. What do people say about this? They feel as if ‘I am indeed the one seeing this.’ But what do You say? ‘You’ say that it feels as if it is the intellect that is seeing this. Otherwise, people will indeed say, “This is visible to me” and “I am seeing this.” That itself is the illusion.

‘One’ is considered to be the real [true] Knower if it comes into Knowing. That is the Knower-Seer! And this does indeed come into Your experience again and again, but such an exact clarification has to be made.

Questioner: How can one become aware of the demarcation that ‘this’ knowing and seeing is through the intellect and ‘this other’ Knowing and Seeing is that of the Self?

Dadashri: The intellect can only know and see that which can be seen through the eyes, or else that which can be heard through the ears or that which can be tasted by the tongue; all of this is [knowing and seeing through] the intellect.

Questioner: So that covers things related to the sense organs, but there are other things that are going on within, which the intellect can see such as, ‘He is biased, he is like this, he is like that.’ It is also the intellect that sees all that, isn’t it?

Dadashri: When all such things are seen, it is indeed of the intellect. Whereas the Knowledge and Vision of the Self is actual Knowing and Seeing; that is something different. To Know and See the eternal elements, to Know their phases, to Know their properties, to Know and See all that, that is the Self.

Questioner: After attaining Gnan, the feeling of ‘I am separate from the body’ that mahatmas(Self-realized Ones on the Akram path) keep experiencing, the awakened awareness (laksh) of ‘I am pure Soul’ that has been established, and all the activity of Seeing that keeps happening thereafter, all that happens through Pragnya, doesn’t it?

Dadashri: It is all indeed the work of Pragnyashakti (the liberating energy of the Self). Pragnya exists up to a certain extent; it is there until the ‘files’ are to be cleared. Once the ‘files’ are all cleared, then it is You (pote) indeed, the Self (Atma) who Knows.

Pragnya means it can be said that it is indeed the Self that is showing that. But ultimately, Pragnya comes to an end. As long as there is Pragnya, One is the pure Soul (Shuddhatma) and the [original] Self is Parmatma (the absolute Self). In fact, they are one and the same, but it is only after this [state as the pure Soul] is attained, that the other [Parmatma] happens automatically!

The One Who Knows Everything Is the Knower-Seer

Questioner: Yesterday, when he was crying, He could See that Chandubhai is crying, and at the same time, ‘Dada Bhagwan Na Aseem Jai Jaikar Ho (infinite glorious salutations to Dada Bhagwan, the Lord within),’ was going on within. So then, who was the One Seeing Chandubhai and who was the one singing ‘Aseem Jai Jaikar Ho’?

Dadashri: Actually, the ‘record’ [of Dada Bhagwan Na Aseem Jai Jaikar Ho] indeed constantly plays within.

Questioner: Meaning that the ‘original tape’ indeed continues playing within?

Dadashri:That is constantly playing at certain times indeed. So, the ‘record’ that plays, the speaker of the ‘record’is separate, and He is the OneSeeing Chandubhai.

Questioner: Is it the pure Soul that is Seeing Chandubhai?

Dadashri: All this that Chandubhai is doing, the seer of that is the intellect.

Questioner: If the intellect is seeing, then how can One be the Knower-Seer?

Dadashri: The Knower-Seer is the One who is the Seer of all these, the Knower-Seer is the One who Knows all of these at a time. What is this feeling within, what ‘record’ is playing, the Knower-Seer Knows all such things at a time.

Questioner:But is it the pure Soul that Sees what the intellect is doing?

Dadashri: It Sees the intellect, it Sees what the mind is doing, it Sees the speech, it Sees what the ego is doing, it Sees all of that.

Questioner: It Sees as the Knower-Seer, does it not? The One who is Seeing that, that is the Knower-Seer, correct?

Dadashri: Yes. That is indeed the Self.

Questioner: And that which sees Chandubhai, is that the intellect?

Dadashri:The intellect sees him, and the One Seeing the intellect is the Self. What the intellect is doing, what the mind is doing, what the ego is doing, the Knower of all that is the Self. Beyond the state as the Self is the state of Parmatma. The One who has become the pure Soul, goes towards becoming Parmatma, and the One who becomes Parmatma, for Him, keval Gnan (absoluteKnowledge) will manifest. The moment keval Gnan manifests for Him, He will have become Parmatma. ‘He’ will have become ‘full’ [complete]; He will have become worthy of attaining the state of nirvana (final liberation). Therefore, You should maintain the applied awareness as the Self (upayog) of Knowing and Seeing, all day long.

Questioner: Dada, does this mean that after the state of the pure Soul, is the next state that of Parmatma?

Dadashri: The pure Soul is itself Parmatma, but keval Gnan has not yet manifested. Once the pure Soul attains keval Gnan, One becomes Parmatma.

By Finding a Solution, the Function as the Knower Disappears

Questioner: I do feel that ‘I am the pure Soul,’ ‘I am the Knower-Seer,’ but nevertheless, the feeling of happiness and sorrow that arises in the mind, why does that happen?

Dadashri: That should definitely happen. However many cups of tea you are meant to drink, you have brought forth that account within you. You will have to drink both, what’s bitter and what’s sweet. When it is sweet, the mind will find it a bit pleasurable and when it is bitter, the mind will find it a bit unpleasant. [Despite this,] ‘You’ are the Knower of both of them; You should not have attachment or abhorrence.

Questioner: ‘I’ am the Knower of both of them, but am ‘I’ not taking a step backwards by doing this?

Dadashri: No, it’s not a step backward; rather, You are advancing forward. ‘You’ are moving ahead with great vigor. Otherwise, I would have had to come to your home to admonish you, asking why you are doing this after receiving this beautiful Gnan.

There is no need to find a solution; You just have to keep Seeing! Keep Seeing how much the anger has increased, how much it has decreased. As the goal (upey;the Self) has been attained, there is no need to find a solution. By finding a solution, the Self’s function as the Knower (Gnatapanu) goes away, meaning that the real benefit goes away. ‘This much tension has arisen, it has increased by this much, now it has gone away.’ ‘You’ have to keep Seeing all these gneya (objects to be Known), remain as the Knower. Whereas by seeking solutions, there will be mental peace [temporarily].

The extent to which You are the Knower-Seer, when Your neighbor is in a distressful condition, You are the Knower of that. So, it should not be that, ‘This distressful condition is happening to me.’

Questioner: But Dada, You too are the Knower-Seer, right?

Dadashri: Yes, of course, what else would this state be? Besides the state as the Knower-Seer, there is nothing else for Him. There is no state beyond it. Gnayakta (Knowership), Gnayak swabhaav (the inherent nature of being the continuous Knower)! Gnayak swabhaav means the state as the Knower-Seer. There is nothing besides that, and You too are in that state. ‘You’ simply have to look after your ‘neighbor’. If Your ‘neighbor’ cries, You shouldn’t cry along with him. ‘You’ should place a hand over him, saying, ‘‘We’ are with you!’

If You Do Not Interfere, There Is No Attachment and Abhorrence

Questioner: Many times when I have a strong desire that does not get fulfilled, I lose my temper, I get angry with everyone, and I’m not able to remain in Gnan. So how can I clear all this and remain as the Knower-Seer?

Dadashri:Whatever the situation may be, You can remain as the Knower-Seer if You want to. If You want to remain as the Knower-Seer, then You can do so in situations up to a certain point. If it becomes excessive and there is a lot of pressure, then You will not be able to do so. Now, even if the jagruti did not remain, You should Know, ‘The jagruti did not remain and ‘I’ am the Knower of that, too!’ Therefore, You should only remain as the Knower. Then all of that [karma] will discharge; it will become powerless [the karma will discharge]. The ‘charge’ will leave; it will all burn away. Tell me, how are your dealings with people? Does attachment and abhorrence (raag-dwesh) occur? Not at all?

Questioner: It does not. That is to say, if there are very sticky ‘files’, then it does happen. But with others, it has decreased significantly.

Dadashri:‘You’ have attained Self-realization, so attachment and abhorrence does not arise [in charge form], but discharge attachment and abhorrence does occur, and that is something to clear away. Now, that which is to be cleared away is not considered to be attachment and abhorrence. Attachment and abhorrence is that which is sown in the form of a ‘seed’; the ones that get ‘charged’ are called attachment and abhorrence. That other reaction is simply gusso (anger without a violent intent; discharge anger), and that is an attribute of the pudgal. Hence, it isn’t something of great significance.

Questioner: There is the gusso of, ‘He did this to me, so I will do the same to him.’ Does that charge [karma] or not?

Dadashri: If Chandubhai is displaying such gusso, but You do not like it, then that is discharge. If You do not like it or You do not have an inclination (ruchi) towards it, then You are not liable.

If You simply keep Seeing all that has happened, then You are free. ‘You’ do not have anything to do with it. It is not Your responsibility, but it is Chandubhai’s responsibility. When that person scolds Chandubhai, saying, “You are so worthless! Why do you keep speaking nonsense?” Then Chandubhai might even slap him. So the liability is Chandubhai’s! ‘You’ should then tell Chandubhai, ‘Why did you do atikraman (hurt someone through the mind, speech, body)? So do pratikraman (confess, apologize, and resolve to not repeat the mistake).’

Questioner: But suppose Chandubhai didn’t do pratikraman. Then it [karma] got charged, didn’t it?

Dadashri: No, even then, it does not get charged. It cannot charge whatsoever.

Questioner: But should pratikraman be done?

Dadashri: If pratikraman is done, then that ‘file’ gets cleared. With Gnan, they were clearedand put away. However many ‘clothes’ you wash, that many ‘clothes’ you should clean and put away. Then they will go for ‘ironing’.

Chandu Feels Remorse, You Keep Knowing Him

Up until now you were saying, “It happened to me,” but now, after attaining Gnan, You don’t agree with that statement! Hey, how can it happen to You? Dada has separated You! Has He not separated You?

Questioner: ‘I’ am indeed separate.

Dadashri: Yes, so then You should definitely maintain the separation, shouldn’t You! By saying, “It happened to me,” the entire world is suffering from a psychological disorder. One says, “My own son’s father-in-law hurled an insult at me!”

And if a mistake is made and Chandubhai does not feel remorse for it, then that too is wrong. Remorse should definitely be felt. ‘You’ should keep Knowing that, ‘Chandubhai is very remorseful.’ Then, suppose You pat Chandubhai’s shoulder; however, if he takes support of this and stops feeling remorseful, then it will remain pending. Remorse should definitely arise. The one who has done a wrong deed should definitely feel remorse over it. Therefore, once he feels remorseful, You should tell him, ‘Now do pratikraman for the mistake and make the resolve to never repeat the mistake (pratyakhyan). ‘I’ am here with you. Now come on, ask for the energy.’ This is Akram Vignan (the spiritual Science of the step-less path to Self-realization).

The Karmic Account Is Cleared by Seeing

Questioner: ‘I’ am aware when a mistake is happening; ‘I’ even scold him internally, ‘Chandubhai, what you are doing is not right.’ But even then, he does not listen and he continues doing it.

Dadashri:There is no problem with that, because the Seer is pure (shuddha). There is purity and impurity in the object He is Seeing, and that too [the purity and impurity], is through a relative perspective. However, for the [real] Seer, there is no purity or impurity. For the Seer, everything is the same indeed. It is the minds of these people that categorize things as right or wrong, but there is no right or wrong in the Lord’s Vision. Society defines things as right and wrong. The Lord actually says, “‘You’ become free when You See it.” ‘You’ are separate and they are also separate. So what happened here? When You clear the karmic account which was bound through agnan (ignorance of the Self), by Seeing it, You become free, and it too becomes free. The karmic account which was [previously] bound without Seeing, by clearing it upon Seeing it, You become free!

Suffering Arises From Sitting in the Wrong ‘Seat’

Questioner: Dada, what Chandubhai wants to do and what Chandubhai should do are two different things. So, for example, Chandubhai wants to go see a movie, but many guests have come to his home. So he knows that he should help with some household work. However, he lacks sincerity in this matter. So, how can sincerity be instilled in him?

Dadashri: ‘You’ should just be patient and keep Seeing what happens. So that is enough! So complete sincerity is encompassed in that.

Questioner: But Chandubhai is the kind of person who would stick his hand right in the fire.

Dadashri: No, even then, You should See to what extent did Chandubhai stick his hand in there, You should See whether Chandubhai stuck his hand to this extent or that extent. ‘You’ are actually ‘clear’. I have placed You on the ‘seat’ that is ‘clear’. Why are You becoming ‘unclear’? Which position are You sitting on? It is on Your reserved ‘seat’, isn’t it? Are You sitting in the place where Your reservation has been made or in an unreserved place? Chandubhai is pleasure-seeking, so he is the kind of person who would go and sit on an unreserved ‘seat’.

Questioner: The fact that ‘I’ end up sitting on that other ‘seat’, what should ‘I’ do so that ‘I’ don’t sit there? And how can ‘I’ remain only on this one [the ‘seat’ of the Self]? Meaning, ‘I’ repeatedly get involved in doership!

Dadashri: When You sit on that other ‘seat’ and experience a ‘shock’, then Know, ‘This is not Mine.’ And if a ‘shock’ is experienced, then get up. The ‘seat’ that gives You a ‘shock’ is not Your ‘seat’.

Questioner: Despite experiencing a ‘shock’, ‘I’ still keep sitting there.

Dadashri: Then have fun! Relish it, have some water and fritters!

Questioner: Despite experiencing a ‘shock’, He doesn’t get up, so how will He get up? Because He is not able to remain as the Knower-Seer, so what should be done?

Dadashri: Why don’t You See that he is not getting up! The one who is not getting up is not You. There is Chandubhai and then there is You. The one who is not getting up is Chandubhai. ‘You’ should say to Chandubhai, ‘Alright then, keep sleeping. If you want to sit, then sit if it pleases you! ‘I’ will keep on Seeing, and you just sit there.’ There should be a solution, shouldn’t there!

Questioner: So should ‘I’ keep making a note of everything that happens?

Dadashri: Keep Seeing all the activities. If he is constantly bickering, then You should even See that. ‘You’ should say,‘Even this is not my Real form (swaroop).’ That is how Dada’s Gnan is. There is no one [superior] up there; there is no boss above. The superior of all superiors is Dada Bhagwan!

Questioner: So the one who is bickering, which part is that?

Dadashri: That is another part, it is on the side of Chandubhai.

Questioner: So should ‘I’ also keep Seeing the one who is bickering?

Dadashri: ‘See’ that as well!

Questioner: So the One who is Seeing does not say anything, He simply Sees.

Dadashri: There is no superior of the One who Sees. There is no one to scold Him or anything else. Infinite energies lie within, but because You are protecting Chandubhai, all the energies remain veiled. ‘You’ are protecting Chandubhai, aren’t You? ‘You’ are doing it in broad daylight, aren’t You? That is precisely why the energies are not blossoming! If You remain in the Agnas (five principles that preserve the awareness as the Self in Akram Vignan), then samadhi (a blissful state that comes about when one becomes free from mental, physical, and externally-induced suffering)will not leave. ‘You’ remain seated in Your ‘seat’, while Chandubhai remains seated in his ‘seat’. The problems and their resultant suffering arise because You are attempting to sit on Chandubhai’s ‘seat’. It is a habit that was ingrained in the past!

‘You’ need to move away from the outside, and sit in Your own ‘seat’. Now, which ‘seat’ is Yours? There are four to five kinds of ‘seats’ inside. So the ‘seat’ that is Yours is the one that feels really ‘easy’ [comfortable], that is Your ‘seat’. If the slightest friction is felt, then Know that this is another ‘seat’. If it causes uneasiness, then Know this, or else if a ‘shock’ is felt, then understand that a ‘shock’ was felt. Do not sit in any of those ‘seats’, sit in Your ‘seat’.

Someone may flatter you by saying, “Chandubhai, sir, you are a very worthy man, you are a very nice man.” But if he flatters you [Chandubhai], should You get flattered? The ‘seat’ that is called Chandubhai is not Yours. Dada has moved You away from there. It is because [you believed,] ‘I am Chandubhai’ that you were taking a beating.

Whenever any suffering (bhogavato) arises, You can understand, ‘‘I’ am sitting on another ‘seat’, this is not My ‘seat’.’ So You should get up from there and sit in the ‘seat’ of the pure Soul. ‘You’ should sit in Your ‘seat’, but You remain seated there [in the other ‘seat’], as if You will get paid double the amount for it! If the slightest wrong thought arises in the mind, then You should immediately Know, ‘‘I’ am on the wrong ‘seat’, ‘I’ am not in My ‘seat’.’ ‘You’ should go to Your ‘seat’ immediately. ‘You’ remain seated there for a long time, don’t You?

Questioner: Yes, Dada. That happens.

Dadashri: That is why your face looks disgruntled. I wondered, ‘Why does his face look disgruntled?’ When any difficulty arises, You should immediately go to Your ‘seat’. Moreover, ask for forgiveness for whatever mistakes have happened.

It is not worth getting entangled in this world. If entanglement arises, if some entanglement arises within the body, then immediately get up and sit in Your ‘seat’. Keep Seeing it; You should say, ‘Chandubhai, why have you become entangled?’

‘You’ will eventually have to get up from wherever You were sitting. ‘We’ would even seat Chandubhai there, saying, “Now Chandubhai can do this and he can do that” but if You remain seated on that ‘seat’, then ‘we’ give You a slight push away from there. ‘You’ should sit in every position and then get up from there. It may feel a bit pleasant, but if You remain seated there for a few days, then ‘we’ give You a nudge. Ultimately, You have to get up and come here [onto the ‘seat’ of the Self].

Have Conversations With ‘File’ Number One

Questioner: How can ‘I’ analyze Chandubhai’s inherent nature?

Dadashri: What do You and Chandubhai have to do with each other? ‘You’ have become the pure Soul, haven’t You! Chandubhai is Your neighbor, ‘file’ number one. What do You have to do with him?

Questioner: ‘File’ number one is one’s own self. Sometimes it becomes very hard to handle him. ‘I’ then have to scold him.

Dadashri: ‘You’ have to get Your [spiritual] work done by convincing and cajoling him. If he is a little inflated then You have to tell him, ‘Calm down. You need to improve now.’

Questioner: Even when ‘I’ say such things, this ‘file’ does not listen. This happens a lot.

Dadashri: It will work out if you use Dada’s name. Tell him, ‘At least listen to Dada!’ If there is a shortcoming to some extent, then You will have to clear it again. Subsequently, there will not be a problem. But do You actually tell him this? From the moment You tell this to ‘file’ number one, You become the pure Soul. Isn’t that a wonder! Is that not significant enough proof? From the moment You tell this to him, where do You reside?

Questioner: In the pure Soul.

Dadashri: So is that something that’s trivial? When You say, ‘This is file number one,’ You become the pure Soul completely. Now, besides ‘file’ number one, what else remains? The answer is, ‘Only the pure Soul!’

If he becomes excited, tell him, ‘Chandubhai, calm down a little. Don’t do this. Do your work slowly.’ You are both separate for sure. The One who is giving instructions and the one doing it, both are separate. The One giving instructions is the cautioner. Who does the cautioning? The Self (Chetan). The cautioner and the one who is doing things, the two are separate. So then You should say, ‘Why are you rushing like this? Take your time and work slowly!’ If he is ever agitated one day, then he would end up ruining it for five other people. So, You should tell him, ‘You were agitated before you left home, so don’t try to rush things over here.’ ‘You’ should tell him such things. How is it going to work out without clearing it with equanimity? If you are agitated and you sit down to eat, will that work? Eating should be done in a methodical manner. Having said that, agitation may arise. As a human being, who would not get agitated? It is only the Gnani (the One who has realized the Self and is able to do the same for others) who does not get agitated. Everyone else is bound to become agitated, aren’t they! Do you get agitated?

Questioner: Many times I even get depressed.

Dadashri: ‘You’ should tell him, ‘Don’t get depressed. Why are You getting depressed? ‘I’ am with You.’

Questioner: Is it possible for ‘file’ number one to be depressed?

Dadashri: Yes, it is. If he does not get depressed, then what else will happen? If he becomes elevated, then he will also become depressed. He will either feel happy, pleased, or unhappy; that is what he gets up to. But You do not have anything to do with that.

Clearing ‘File’ Number One

Questioner: When can ‘I’ say that ‘file’ number one has been truly cleared?

Dadashri: When ‘file’ number one is very upset, and at that moment he cools down, then Know that ‘file’ number one has been properly cleared.

Questioner: Please explain that exactly.

Dadashri: He will get upset, but now it will come to an end, won’t it! It is always the case that whatever circumstance comes forth, it is bound to dissipate. Meaning that it will definitely dissipate on its own. Until then, You should not let go of Your steadiness (sthirata). It will go away. These were created by you. Is it as though there is anyone else’s interference in this? If there was someone who was interfering, then a complaint could be raised to them that, ‘This is what is happening to me.’ But in this case, you cannot even say anything, can you? Should You not understand the result of your own interference? And if You See it with separation, then it is such that it will leave.

Questioner: Dada, when ‘I’ am clearing this ‘file’ number one, whatever is happening within, it keeps coming in My vision (drashti); so does that mean that ‘file’ number one is being cleared?

Dadashri: Why would it not be getting cleared? Previously, you did not even have such a perspective on ‘file’ number one. Whatever you were doing, you used to say, ‘I am the one doing it.’ Now, it is that ‘file’ number one is doing it, and You are Knowing that.

Questioner: It so happens that there is internal conflict happening and simultaneously ‘I’ am Knowing that too.

Dadashri: Conflict cannot arise at all. This spiritual Science (Vignan) itself is such that a conflict cannot arise at all.

Questioner: So then what is it that is happening inside?

Dadashri: That is suffocation. When entanglements arise, because You are not able to understand anything, You end up feeling perplexed.

Questioner: Dada, how can ‘I’ get rid of this suffocation?

Dadashri: ‘You’ should remain in the Agnas of the Gnani Purush (One who has realized the Self and is able to do the same for others) properly and methodically.

The Body Is an Object to be Known and You Are the Continuous Knower

Questioner: ‘We’ are clearing all other ‘files’ with equanimity, but please explain in detail how to clear ‘file’ number one with equanimity. This is because all the interferences are indeed of ‘file’ number one.

Dadashri: Those interferences will leave simply by Seeing them; just by Seeing the ‘file’. Whether he is obstinate or straightforward, You have no issues with the ‘file’. He will go away simply by Seeing him.

‘File’ number one is entirely governed by karma. So if ‘file’ number one does something wrong, what does it have to do with You? Today, You have become the pure Soul. ‘You’ Know that, ‘This ‘file’ must have been created sometime in the past [life], but now ‘I am pure Soul’ and this ‘file’ is governed by vyavasthit.’ So now, if some wrongdoing happens through ‘file’ number one, if he ends up crushing a large insect, then as the pure Soul, it is not Your responsibility. ‘You’ are in fact the Gnayak (the continuous Knower). Now, it is necessary for You to remain in Your own dharma (role; function). In the past, in agnanta (state of ignorance of the Self), you had carried out whichever dharma you had, that of doership. Now, You need to remain in the dharma as the Gnayak. Now, You cannot carry out the dharma of doership. That is in the control of vyavasthit.

The inherent nature of the pure Soul is that of the Gnayak; its inherent nature is not of the doer. What is wrong with being in One’s own form (swaroop), the Real form as the Self, which You have already become? That is the swabhaav (inherent nature as the Self) which You need to remain in. What is the result of remaining as the Gnayak? It is eternal bliss (parmanand). If that is what You want, then You will continue getting it. And these ‘files’ will keep getting cleared with equanimity.

Now, you might utter, “This is mine,” out loud, but it is not felt that way internally, is it! In Your heart, You do not feel like anything is Yours, do You! Even the ‘my-ness’ (mamata) is gone, isn’t it! Ordinarily, not even for an hour can anyone’s ownership of the body go away. When the topic of the body comes up in conversation with others, they will remark, “The body is mine, so of course I will feel pain!” As long as the sense of ‘I am’ is tied to the body, you cannot say anything, can you! Whereas You say, “My ‘file’ is ill; this ‘file’ number one.” That Gnan is not to be taken lightly; it is no ordinary Gnan. This Gnan is so straightforward and easy!

Even this Gnan that has been given holds tremendous jagruti. It is straightforward and easy, but one deliberately creates interference. That is why there is a shortcoming in the jagruti. Nothing will touch You at all if You have the jagruti!

Upon Becoming the Knower-Seer, Interference Ends

Questioner: Dada, now show us a solution to stop the dakho-dakhal (interference and its effects caused by the ego in the unfolding of karma)!

Dadashri: When You become the Knower-Seer, the dakho-dakhal will stop. ‘Your’ intrinsic functional property (gunadharma) is indeed that of the Knower-Seer. When the charitra moha (discharge illusory attachment) arises, Know that, ‘This is discharge illusory attachment.’ ‘You’ should See and Know it. It will go away if You See it.

Questioner: By saying, ‘This is my charitra moha’ or ‘This is my discharge’ will He [a mahatma] not use that as an excuse? Will He not wrongfully protect his mistake in this manner?

Dadashri: When He does so, that too is charitramoha. But if He goes according to His own understanding, if He uproots this Gnan that has been given to Him, then He is not considered as being in this path. If He uproots ‘our’ Gnan and He does not follow the five Agnas; if He does not even remain in the Agnas for fifty percent of the time, then it is all over. Even if He remains in them fifty percent of the time, it is more than enough. After that, even if He ends up doing something wrong, that is also considered charitramoha.

Questioner: So even that is called charitramoha?

Dadashri: Yes, of course! It is clearly charitramoha, but don’t tell this to others. You should not tell others about this. You can tell me. Other people will discourage You and whatever steadiness has arisen in You, they will even make that become unsteady. If You tell me, then I will explain to You as to what this is!

Questioner: But this is a fact, is it not? This definitely falls under charitramoha, right? What else would it be categorized as?

Dadashri:It is indeed discharge in those instances. There is no interference from You in that, is there! If Your interference is present, then You are responsible. What is happening here? [It is happening automatically, as in,] ‘It [just] happens.’ This charitramoha means that ‘it happens [automatically]’. There is no interference in this from You. ‘Do it this way’ or ‘Do it that way,’ You do not have such interference. The work happens when all the circumstances come together on their own. There is no interference in this from You. No influence of any kind of Yours will work in this whatsoever! For You, Your entire state as the doer is gone, so how can You be held accountable? So, there is no need for any of you [mahatmas] to be perplexed. Instead, come and ask me if there is a lot of confusion in your mind.

The pudgal (non-Self complex of input and output) that had gotten charged previously due to these extra attributes (vishesh guna), the ‘stones’ that have become heated up, that is referred to as charitra moha! When Self-realization takes place, One no longer remains the doer, and so interference no longer remains, and the charitra moha gets cleared!

The charitra moha can also be dissolved! If You See it, if You remain as the Knower-Seer, then it will go away. However, if You do not maintain jagruti and You do not make a resolve, then the charitra moha will remain pending!

‘You’ have to See how this moha (illusory attachment) is going away. Chandubhai may be eating, drinking, or bickering, but all of that is moha, which You have to keep Seeing. And so that moha will go away. If You interfere by saying, “Why did you make this so salty?” then it means You made that moha a little sticky again. ‘You’ should not interfere; just keep Seeing it. It is considered moha for sure, but it will only go away by Seeing it. It will be destroyed simply by Seeing it. Charitramoha means discharge moha. Discharge moha means that the control is not in Your hands. It will go away on its own, provided You remain vitaraag (absolutely free from all attachment and abhorrence).

Questioner: But ultimately, charitramoha will have to go away, right?

Dadashri: That charitramoha is going away. All these ‘files’ are of charitramoha only. Once the ‘files’ have been cleared, the ‘full government’ state is established. So it is not that it [charitra moha] should go away, or that it needs to be taken out; it is certainly going away [on its own].

What does the essence of this entire Gnan tell us? If You have already come to Know the Real, then the relative is subject to scientific circumstantial evidence. Therefore, You just continue to See. ‘You’ should not do anything else. Whatever is happening, let it happen. Whatever You are not able to do, don’t do it. ‘You’ should simply continue to See!

Keep Seeing the Discharge

Questioner: After attaining Gnan, do ‘I’ just have to keep Seeing the discharge (galan), or should I do something to speed it up?

Dadashri: Who is the one who can speed it up? When the doer himself has gone away, who can speed it up?

Questioner: So should we just allow it to happen on its own?

Dadashri: Just keep Seeing. Just keep Seeing whatever is happening. Whatever You had charged (puran) will now give its fruit [effect] and discharge. It will be bitter if it was bitter, and sweet if it was sweet. Both will give its effect and discharge, You have to keep Seeing that. ‘You’ should not interfere at all with any such talks about speeding it up.

If You make the slightest mistake in this straightforward Science, then it is such that You may take a beating. If any confusion arises, then come to me; I will repeat the ‘operation’ [Gnan Vidhi] for you. There is a possibility for confusion to arise due to lack of understanding, isn’t there!

Questioner: Is it a mistake if I let go?

Dadashri: ‘You’ can never let go of the function as the Knower. To function as the Knower is indeed Your inherent nature, and the object to be Known (gneya) is certainly always there. This mind that exists, that ‘file’ will keep showing until one’s lifespan is over. It will keep showing, and You keep Seeing. If there are no objects to be Known, then the Knower cannot exist. Therefore, these objects to be Known are like a film. The mind will show right until the end, so the Knower cannot go away.

The Traffic of Circumstances Causes a Lapse in Seeing

Questioner: Whatever discharge of mine unfolds, ‘I’ just keep Seeing it; ‘I’ do not do anything else. Is that correct?

Dadashri: Yes, that is correct.

Questioner: Why doesn’t the Gnan remain uninterruptedly? Why does it decline once more and then rise again?

Dadashri: It cannot decline. Once it rises, it does not decline. The Gnan will remain precisely as Gnan. Once a person becomes blind, he cannot see anything. Whereas in this case, You can actually See once again, can’t You?

“Keval nijswabhaavnu akhand varte Gnan,

Kahiye keval Gnan te, deha chhata nirvana.”

“When nothing but the Knowledge of the inherent nature as the Self prevails continuously,

That is considered absolute Knowledge, wherein One experiences ultimate liberation despite having a body.”

- Shrimad Rajchandra

‘He’ [Shrimad Rajchandra, a Self-realized Gnani of the step-by-step path, who lived between 1867-1901] says that despite having a body, there is the state of nirvana.

Questioner: Dada, it is very difficult for it to become continuous (akhand).

Dadashri: Oh, it does not take long for that which is discontinuous (khand) to become continuous. The One [whose Gnan] has reached a discontinuous [state] should not worry about it becoming continuous. It has begun in a discontinuous [state] for the very sake of becoming continuous.

Questioner: Dada, what happens is that, when I do any activity, before starting it, that awareness (dhyan) is present. Then once I get involved in that activity, it is forgotten for half an hour. Once that activity is over, the conviction [as the Self] returns.

Dadashri:What is that like? I will explain it to you. Suppose we were all sitting in chairs on the slope of Kothi [in the city of Baroda], at a crossroads over there. If we wanted to look across the road, would we be able to see anything while a bus is crossing through? So, as long as the buses keep coming and going, we would not be able to see continuously [across the road]. Hey, the buses will stop coming and going! By nightfall, they will stop altogether on their own, in no time.

Questioner: Dada, how did you suddenly give all of us such a simple, beginner-level example?

Dadashri: Yes, but what else can be done? It will be helpful, won’t it! This person is feeling anxious about when it will become continuous! It is not worth getting anxious over it. Once all of these ‘buses’ [‘files’] stop, it will certainly remain without interruption, continuous. ‘Your’ Gnan is certainly continuous. These ‘buses’ are raising objection, and it is the circumstance of ‘buses’. And those circumstances are prone to disassociation (viyogi) by their inherent nature. They will quickly pass. Now You are not creating new circumstances.

Questioner: Dada, we would have to sit with you for ten days to understand all of this, yet you explained it in just one sentence, that it is just the buses that are running in between. From this, we should now experience this for ourselves, as to ‘What is the need to trouble ourselves unnecessarily?’

Dadashri:Mind you, what You already have is moksha. It is just that these ‘buses’ keep coming and going in between. Can You not say anything to those bus drivers? ‘You’ cannot say anything because You want to attain moksha. There could even be a double decker bus or a single decker bus. And if an elephant passes by, that would block the view as well. But these are just circumstances. So, as many as there are, they will keep coming and going, and eventually, it [the Gnan] will indeed remain continuously. It is there continuously for sure. Having said that, although it does not remain continuously, Dada does remain continuously [present] for some mahatmas, doesn’t He?

So, You will understand the meaning of continuous this way! Just look how much entanglement there was: ‘It became interrupted; now when will it become continuous?’ Now, whose baadha (a vow taken in an ignorant state by the devotee to get a desired result in life) will you take [to make it continuous]? It is continuous for sure. Do you now understand [that it is] continuous? It seemed very difficult that, ‘Oh! When will this come to an end and when will it remain [continuous]?’ The end has come! There is a need for regular practice of this over here. This is Akram Vignan, so it is necessary to remain in touch. This spiritual Science is attained just once and the jagruti of it does not ever leave. Anyone who has met me once and has taken Gnan, His jagruti never leaves.

Now, to remain as the Knower-Seer is considered Charitra (Conduct as the Self) itself. However, You are not able to remain so, because You have thousands of worldly entanglements. How can You remain as the Knower-Seer when the ‘buses’ keep coming and going in between? ‘You’ say that You cannot See because of the ‘buses’; it [the Gnan] is certainly there, but You cannot See because of the ‘buses’. So I ask you, “Have these buses been arranged by you or by someone else?” So you say, “Yes, it is my own arrangement.” I ask, “Even the double decker buses?” So you respond, “Yes, even the double decker ones.” It’s a situation that you’ve set up yourself. All of my ‘buses’ have stopped, whereas yours are still running, aren’t they!

Questioner: When the traffic of the ‘buses’ comes, the view gets blocked, so then what should ‘I’ See in that case?

Dadashri:The gneya can be Seen. The Self is like a mirror. Taking this analogy of the Self being like a mirror, whatever is [reflected] in the ‘mirror’ is exactly what is in front of the ‘mirror’. Suppose there is a decorated pole placed in front of it, but why did that stop appearing in the ‘mirror’? The pole gets normally reflected inside. When the pole stops getting reflected, One shouts, ‘‘I’ can no longer See the pole within My Self.’ The reason behind this is that the ‘buses’ are passing by in between.

The Self is the Knower-Seer. So, it does not See the way these eyes do. Everything is reflected in it. Does any activity need to be done in Knowing and Seeing? When things are reflected in the mirror, does the mirror have to make any effort towards that? If you pass in front of it, you will be able to see yourself.

To Be the Knower-Seer of the Prakruti Is Considered Conduct as the Self

Before, you were in the nature of a human being (maanav swabhaav), in which there was, ‘This is right and this is wrong. These are good thoughts and these are bad thoughts.’ Now, You have come into the inherent nature of the Self (Atma swabhaav), so all thoughts are alike! Thoughts are simply gneya (objects to be Known) andYou are the Gnata (Knower). It is a relationship of the gneya and the Gnata. So tell me, what interference remains thereafter?

Now, someone may ask, “Why is Chandubhai’s conduct like this after attaining this Gnan?” I would say to them, “Dear fellow, do not look at his conduct, because his belief is different from his conduct. His belief is completely different from that.”

Have You not experienced that your conduct is different from what is in Your belief? This is because your conduct is based on the belief of the past life, and today You have acquired a new belief. So, the conduct that will arise based on this [new] belief will be of a completely different kind. First, it becomes established in belief, thereafter it manifests in conduct.

The establishment of the conviction that ‘I am the Self’ is itself samyak Darshan, and what else is there besides the Self? The answer is pudgal.

Questioner: So this word ‘belief,’ is it used to represent ordinary beliefs (maanyata)?

Dadashri: This Darshan (Vision as the Self) is a much higher thing than those [ordinary] beliefs. Right now, does it caution You from within or not?

Questioner: It cautions.

Dadashri:Yes, the Self (pote; Pragnya) can caution You only after it is experienced. Now, that is considered Gnan. And when can it be called Charitra (Conduct as the Self)? When there is no external interference, that is when Charitra prevails. When there are no hassles of having to go to work or doing other things, not having to wear clothes; there are no other hassles. Charitra means the Knower-Seer (Gnata-Drashta); that is all. But the Knower-Seer of what? ‘You’ are the Knower-Seer of what Chandubhai is doing. To remain as the Knower-Seer of One’s own prakruti is called Charitra.

Be the Knower-Seer by Sitting in the ‘Seat’ of the Pure Soul

As You remain the Knower-Seer, it will all let go naturally. If You try to let go of it, it won’t work. If You become the Knower-Seer, then it will let go. Just for one day, on a Sunday, try to sit on the ‘seat’ of the pure Soul and everything will run smoothly! Just remain the Knower-Seer. Keep Seeing what Chandubhai is doing.

Questioner: Now, whether Chandubhai does something good or bad, should ‘I’ See that?

Dadashri: As far as whether he does good or not is concerned, there is actually no such thing as good or bad. Good or bad is based on societal norms. There is no such thing as good or bad for God. There is no such thing as profit or loss for God either.

Questioner: So then the intent that we have to remain in accordance with societal and worldly norms, the worldly interactions part of our life; how should we maintain that?

Dadashri: Your worldly interactions should be such that people praise them, they consider them ideal. People will say, “Don’t talk about Chandubhai; he is a very good man.” But as things are, he doesn’t even look good in his own home. The mortal one; it’s fine if the neighbors don’t say that he is a good man, but he doesn’t even look good in his own home.

Questioner: But what is the solution for that?

Dadashri: Exactly as I said, remain as the Knower-Seer.

Questioner: ‘I’ definitely remain as the Knower-Seer, but if Chandubhai does something wrong, or if he tries to make things right, but things still turn out wrong, then what should ‘I’ do to take care of that?

Dadashri: ‘You’ cannot improve anything. On the contrary, You will ruin things. If it is already eighty percent ruined, then You will ruin it by ninety percent.

Questioner: Should ‘I’ not supervise or provide guidance to Chandubhai?

Dadashri: Supervision means to just Know and See. Do not give any kind of guidance whatsoever.

Questioner: ‘I’ should not improve him or take on any kind of doership, so is there no chance of improvement at all?

Dadashri: He will not improve at all. On the contrary, One spoils Himself in trying to improve him [Chandubhai].

Questioner: ‘I’ should tell him, ‘Shut up, leave me alone, how dare you…’

Dadashri: No, You should not tell him ‘How dare you!’ ‘You’ are not a police officer, You are God. The police officers will say things like ‘How dare you!’ [and threaten the person]; You are God, so keep Seeing. ‘You’ are to be in Your inherent state as the Knower-Seer and he will be in his inherent state of doership. The one whose inherent nature is of doership will continue causing problems. The inherent nature of the pudgal is that of doership.

Past Karma Are a Hindrance to Remaining as the Knower-Seer

Questioner: You have told us [mahatmas] to remain as the Knower-Seer; so what hinders us in remaining as the Knower-Seer?

Dadashri: It is the unfolding of past karma that comes in the way of You remaining as the Knower-Seer. Now, all the past karma will entangle You. Thoughts will arise in the mind, but You should not become entangled in them. ‘You’ should not become mixed up in them. They are gneya and You are the Gnata. The relation that remains with this world is that of gneya and Gnata. There is no other relation with the world anymore. Now, do not get involved in any other relations at all.

Questioner: The dualities, those vibrations have not been eradicated, have they?

Dadashri: No, they remain in the form of gneya, don’t they! That is all in the form of gneya. And it confuses You into thinking, ‘Is this taking hold of me or what?’ ‘You’ just have to See whether or not the attachment and abhorrence are decreasing day by day.

Questioner: After Self-realization, the questions or the confusion that arises does not fall under the division of the Self, does it?

Dadashri:They are all gneya and they are in discharge form. And they are not in Your control; they are under the control of vyavasthit. Their intrinsic nature (swabhaav) and Your intrinsic nature are different. Their intrinsic nature is of gneya, while Your intrinsic nature is of the Gnata. The gneya are vitaraag, the Gnata is also vitaraag, and the ego that exists in between causes attachment and abhorrence. [After Gnan] As the ego has departed, One should maintain vitaraagi bhaav(a state of freedom from attachment and abhorrence) with the gneya. If the gneya is scorned, then it will do the same in return. Nevertheless, if negative worldly intents (paudgalik bhaavo) arise within, then You should do pratikraman. Whatever remains after attaining this Gnan, remains in the form of gneya. Whatever arose within, it is a gneya, and You are the Gnata.

That Which Does Not Interfere in the Unfolding Karma Is Called Gnan

When You interfere in the unfolding karma, the intellect is prevailing, and when You don’t interfere in the unfolding karma, Gnan is prevailing. This is the difference between Gnan and the intellect.

Questioner: Interference occurs only through the intellect, does it not?

Dadashri: All this interference is only of the intellect. It is indeed this intellect that has caused all the confusion and mistakes. There would be no such thing in Gnan at all. There would certainly be no interference where there is Gnan, would there! Yes, Chandubhai may interfere, and when You Know this through Gnan, You are free.

God does not maintain an account book in which He notes ‘Who took it? Who gave it? This person gave it to that person and that person took it.’ God is so wise! ‘He’ does not keep an account book at all. The accounts are all clear, the accounts are all clear even without an account book! That is why I have said, “God does not maintain an account book, whereas the intellect does.” It meddles in the unfolding karma; it ‘sticks its finger’ in the unfolding karma. Hey! This person is giving based on his unfolding karma, while that person is taking based on his unfolding karma. So what is the need for You to meddle in that? It is the unfolding karma that is giving, isn’t it? And it is also the unfolding karma that is taking. So in that case, what is the need to debit and credit anything? But this is the interference of the intellect. If You do not interfere in the unfolding karma, that is called Gnan. It is complete Gnan! Here, on this path, You certainly have some Gnan, but keval Gnan is that which does not interfere in the unfolding karma! ‘You’ certainly have samyak Gnan (Knowledge in the realm of the Real). But now, before attaining keval Gnan, will You not need all these kinds of things? ‘You’ indeed have Gnan, but won’t all this [interference] hinder You from attaining keval Gnan?

Questioner: What remains for the attainment ofkeval Gnan?

Dadashri: ‘You’ should check to See where the interference of the intellect still remains. There is no problem if Chandubhai is the doer of the interference of the intellect. ‘You’ should simply not become one with those interferences. If You See them, then You are in Your ‘account’ [inherent nature as the Self]. And if You lapse in Your ‘account’ [inherent nature as the Self], then it can be said that You have interfered in the unfolding karma. It is Chandubhai’s unfolding karma, but it should not be such that You become one with it. Then it will not affect You.

Besides the State as the Knower-Seer, Everything Is Interference

Questioner: So does that mean that if the state as the Knower-Seer does not remain, there is dakho-dakhal?

Dadashri: Yes, everything besides the state of the Knower-Seer is dakho-dakhal, and that itself is called worldly life! But now, the reality is that One cannot remain the Knower-Seer, a person does not have that much energy (shakti). Otherwise, if One remains the Knower-Seer, it means He has indeed become God! But until then, what should One do? If a thought arises to interfere, then do pratikraman at that time. So then it is not considered dakhal. Interference did happen, but You turned it around.

Questioner: You stated a very important point. But it is not possible for a person to See every single time, is it?

Dadashri: If One cannot remain in that state, then pratikraman should be done. Pratikraman should be done when such a thought arises. If You cannot remain as the Knower-Seer in exactness, then pratikraman should be done.

Who is it that has to do pratikraman? The pratikraman is not to be done by You. As this is Akram Vignan, the [veils of] kashay (anger, pride, deceit, and greed) that remain are quite dense. Now, if Chandubhai tells someone off in a way that it hurts the other person, then You have to tell Chandubhai, “Hey, why did you do atikraman? So now, do pratikraman.” ‘You’, as the pure Soul, are not to do the pratikraman!

The atikraman is of the pudgal, and pratikraman is also of the pudgal. The inherent nature of the pure Soul is to continuously remain as the Knower! Tohave the decisive conviction that ‘I am pure Soul,’ that itself is called the experience of the Self!

The Discovery of the Tirthankar Lords

‘You’ are the pure Soul, but although You prevail as the pure Soul on one side, on the other side, You are still also prevailing in that other [the relative]. Meaning, Your awareness still tends to go towards that. ‘Our’ awareness does not go towards that.Therefore, as You move ahead in this manner, by clearing Your ‘files’ with equanimity, the awareness [towards the relative] will start turning around [towards the Real]. Thereafter, the separation will prevail. So when complete separation prevails, it [the relative] will not bother You. Until then, it will continue to interfere a little.

If You want to look at things through ‘our’ perspective (drashti), then You will have to develop a perspective similar to ‘ours’, that the entire world is flawless. The fact that it appears to be at fault to you, that itself is a wrong belief (bhranti). When you consider aperson hurling abuses at you as being at fault, that is a wrong belief. This is because, the one hurling abuses is the power chetan (the pudgal or the relative self that is powered with the life energy in the presence of the Self) and the Real Chetan is actually the pure Soul.So even if he is hurling abuses at you, You still have to See Him as a pure Soul. The power[filled] chetan of the other person is interacting with you [your file one] based on your [file one’s] own karmic account. That karmic account has to be cleared.Once the karmic account has been cleared, nothing remains [pending].

Questioner: Does [the charging] relative self(pratishthit atma) become the pure Soul just through chintavan (envisioning)?

Dadashri: Yes, that is why I am telling you that You have become the pure Soul. Thereafter, if You keep saying, ‘I am pure Soul, I am pure Soul,’ then You will continue to become that form.

Questioner: But if I have become that [the pure Soul], what is the point of saying, ‘I am pure Soul’?

Dadashri: Well, so far, it is just the conviction (pratiti) of the pure Soul that has been established in You. As the conviction has set in, the jagruti will certainly remain, the developing ‘I’ (pote) becomes what He envisions. This envisioning is called chintavan, and that other envisioning, the envisioning done by someone without Self-realization, is considered a psychological effect. This is because it is a mental state. There is nothing mental in this, it is actually chintavan.

This is a discovery of the Tirthankar Lords! ‘You’ are the pure Soul, You are indeed pure; otherwise, if You do any other envisioning, You will become like that. Therefore, I am saying that You should envision Yourself as being nothing but pure: ‘I’ am pure indeed, ‘I’ am pure indeed. ‘You’ should say, ‘Chandubhai, there is no problem. Interfere as much as you want to, but ‘I’ am indeed pure.’

The beliefs that, ‘I am Chandubhai,’ ‘I know this scriptural knowledge by heart,’ ‘I know this shrutgnan (knowledge obtained through listening or reading any matter which takes one further into the relative) by heart’; the Lord has referred to all of that as dehadhyaas (belief that ‘I am the body’). This is because the ingrained belief (adhyaas) that ‘I am Chandubhai’ has not left. The moment One gets the realization that ‘I am pure Soul,’ everything will be resolved!

The State as the Knower-Seer Through the Practice of the Five Agnas

Questioner: ‘‘You’ are indeed the pure Soul, but the experiential awareness (bhaan) of that should arise.’ Please explain that statement.

Dadashri: ‘You’ are the pure Soul for sure. After I gave You Gnan, You are the pure Soul, but the experiential awareness of that should arise. If You are able to remain in the Agnas, then I would know that You have the experiential awareness. Remain in the Agnas by fifty percent, not more than that. Oh, even if You remain in the Agnas by twenty-five percent, I will say that You have experiential awareness, so tell me, at what percentage should I pass a person?

Questioner: That’s true, One should at least follow the Agnas by twenty-five percent.

Dadashri: Now, is it acceptable to just put twenty-five percent sugar in your tea? There, you need one hundred percent sugar, whereas here, You are content with just twenty-five percent!

To follow the five Agnas is called Purusharth, and what happens as a result of following the five Agnas? ‘You’ are able to remain in the stateas the Knower-Seer. And if someone were to ask ‘us’, “What is Real Purusharth?” Then ‘we’ would reply, “It is to remain as the Knower-Seer.” So these five Agnas indeed teach You to remain as the Knower-Seer, don’t they! While Seeing the relative and Real, if any thoughts of the past or future arise, then say that it is vyavasthit and put a stop to them. While Seeing, if thoughts of the future cause botheration, then say that it is vyavasthit, so then it will stop. So then Your Seeing will continue on. If any ‘file’ is bothering You at that time, then clear it with equanimity, but continue with that [Seeing] of Yours. This is how the Agnas keep You in the state as the Knower-Seer.

If You remain in ‘our’ Agnas, that is Purusharth. What other Purusharth is there after becoming the Purush (the Self)?

And when the result of following the Agnas comes, One can remain as the Self, naturally and spontaneously, without the Agnas. That is also considered Purusharth. It is considered a great Purusharth. This is Purusharth through [following] the Agnas and that other is natural Purusharth!

The Keval Gnani Continuously Remains in the State as the Knower-Seer

Questioner: Now, when this jagruti as the pure Soul and the state as the Knower-Seer prevails, at that time, ‘I’ experience that ‘I’ am a completely different entity and feel peace and tranquility.

Dadashri: Of course You will feel that! ‘You’ feel as if it is an altogether different matter indeed and You experience tremendous peace and tranquility. That is known as the peace and tranquility of absolute Knowledge (keval Gnan). Some mahatmas may be able to experience the peace and tranquility of keval Gnan. For many of our mahatmas, often such moments arise within, and they even say, “I am the Real form as absolute Knowledge (Hu keval Gnan swaroop chhu).” They can say that, because for some moments, One does become keval Gnan swaroop. A fractional part of it has arisen. Now, as the karmic debts get cleared within and as the karmic overdrafts are paid off, all of this will be understood.

All of you [mahatmas] have become the Knower-Seer in its entirety, but You can only be considered a keval Gnani (in this case, the One with absolute Knowledge) if You constantly prevail as the Knower-Seer!

It’s like this, the One who constantly prevails as the Knower-Seer is a keval Gnani. But as One prevails [in this state] for a fraction of time, it starts to increase gradually, fraction by fraction. As those [past] karma get cleared, that increases. So, there is no interference in that. This indeed is the path; this is the ‘highway’ indeed. As the ‘files’ start to decrease, the proportion of One’s function as the Knower-Seer keeps increasing. It increases until One eventually attains keval Gnan. It does not happen suddenly.

To Continue Prevailing in the Present Is Itself Keval Gnan

Questioner: Now for us [mahatmas], to continue prevailing in the present is itself keval Gnan, isn’t it?

Dadashri: Yes, it’s keval Gnan, there is nothing else besides this. There is no applied awareness (upayog) on the past, there is no applied awareness on the future, there is applied awarenessonly on the present.

‘You’ have been given such an AkramGnan that You forget the past. The future has been handed over to vyavasthit. So what remains now? The present. Keval Gnan swarooparises; this is the Gnan ‘we’ have given to You.

The past is not something that You can forget, but You should See and Know the past. When You See and Know whatever comes to memory, that is the same as forgetting it. As You continue doing this, once it is forgotten, You will not have to make any effort for it, it will be natural. Until then, the Purush has to do Purusharth and parakram (extraordinary spiritual effort to progress as the Self).

So, all You need to do is to Know and See. Even if You try to do anything else, nothing will come of it. The rest is just useless effort. This is because those old habits that are there do not let up. Otherwise, Your Real form (swaroop) is indeed what You have already attained. There is nothing else that is worth knowing in this world. It [the original Self] is entirely keval Gnan swaroop indeed. So, by Seeing like this, the old habits will gradually leave, and it [the Gnan] will become stronger. There is no problem with the activities of the body. The problem is not with the habits of the body, but You have a habit of getting engrossed in the activities of the body. The applied awareness (upayog) goes into this and it goes into that. If the applied awareness remains free from this, then that is the end! This is keval Gnan swaroop; this Gnan that has been given to You is keval Gnan swaroop.

Questioner: Is it exactly keval Gnan swaroop?

Dadashri: Yes, keval Gnan swaroop, nothing else. When contentment from one’s own form (swaroop) arises, aartadhyan (adverse internal state of being that hurts the self) and raudradhyan (adverse internal state of being that hurts the self and others) stop. ‘You’ don’t have to stop them.

‘Your’ original form is keval Gnan swaroop. Now, there won’t be any ‘attack’ from the outside, will there? What You have attained here, there won’t be any ‘attack’ that makes You lose this, will there? That’s it; You should strengthen Yourself to such an extent that no matter what kind of karma unfold, let them unfold. Whichever ones are coming, tell them, ‘Come, ‘I’ don’t have a problem anymore.’ When there is the unfolding of extremely intense karma from all sides, then You should sit in your ‘cave’ and keep Seeing them. ‘You’ don’t have to come out at all! ‘You’ remain in your ‘home department’; do not stick Your hand out in the ‘foreign’ at all. Just keep Seeing it by remaining steady, completely steady.

This point simply needs to be understood. ‘You’ are indeed keval Gnan swaroop. ‘You’ do not have to go and acquire keval Gnan, it is indeed Your Real form. What is keval Gnan? It is nothing else but Gnan swaroop (in the form of Knowledge).

The Knower-Seer Is Not Liable for the ‘Foreign’

After ‘we’ gave You this Gnan, the ‘home’ and ‘foreign’ [the Self and non-Self] have both been separated. Thereafter, ‘we’ say that if You do not falter in Your state as the Knower-Seer, then You are not liable for the ‘foreign’ [the relative] whatsoever.

Questioner: The awakened awareness (laksh) as the Knower-Seer does not set in properly. It comes and goes.

Dadashri: It will go away. When it remains continuous, then You will have become God. The fact that it goes away means that it will [eventually] become complete. This is because all the work in worldly life still remains pending, doesn’t it! Are all the ‘files’ of worldly life still pending or not?

Questioner: They are still pending.

Dadashri: As those ‘files’ decrease, the laksh will set in increasingly. Everything is held up because of the ‘files’.

Questioner: Grace me so that ‘I’ can remain continuously in the Self. A shortcoming arises in Knowing the effects of the non-Self (parparinaam).

Dadashri: The ‘files’ that You have from the past, You should clear those ‘files’. If any shortcoming arises, then know that it is simply because of those ‘files’. That is why You are not able to continuously remain in the state as the Knower-Seer. That is certainly the reason for it; it is a kind of interference of the ‘files’ from the past life’s karmic account. That is why the continuous state does not remain.

Akram means that moksha has definitely been attained in causal form (kaaran moksha). Nevertheless, however many karma remain, a resolution needs to be brought about for them once and for all by Knowing and Seeing them! While remaining as the Knower-Seer, if a resolution comes by Seeing everything, then ultimate liberation happens. That is all, there is nothing else to it. So, no matter what kind of karma there are, no matter how ‘sticky’ or how bad they are, when You remain as the Knower-Seer, You are free.

To Not Enter the Parkshetra Is Adeethh Tapa

‘You’ have now become the Knower-Seer, so all You have to do is keep Seeing how things are going on for Chandubhai. In addition to that, keep Seeing what is going on in Chandubhai’s mind. The reason being, the mind is no longer under Your control, the intellect is no longer under Your control, the chit is no longer under Your control. All of them have been placed on this side [in the division of the non-Self] and Your division is separate from them. Therefore, You should remain established in Your kshetra (realm) only. Now, You should not come out of Your kshetra. ‘You’ had established yourself in parkshetra (the realm of the non-Self) previously; now, You have come into swakshetra (the realm as the Self), so You should not interfere in parkshetra anymore. Meaning, You should just keep Seeing what Chandubhai’s mind, intellect, chit and all that, are doing. Whether they are engaging in something bad or something wrong, You should not make an intense mental note of that; rather, You should just keep Seeing what they are doing. There is absolutely no such thing as ‘right’ or ‘wrong’ as per God. ‘Right’ and ‘wrong’ is a concept that has been decided upon by society.

‘You’ need to come into Your Real form as the Self (Atma swaroop), nothing else is needed. Whether this body gets cut or something happens to it, You should not prevail as the body. If You happen to enter parkshetra, then worldly life should feel as bitter as poison to You.

The entire world has believed the parkshetra to be their swakshetra. They believe, ‘This [non-Self complex] is verily who I am and this [realm of the non-Self] indeed is my realm!’ When ‘we’ give You this Gnan, You start to understand what parkshetra means, as in ‘Previously, ‘I’ was established in parkshetra, now ‘I’ should remain established in swakshetra.’ But that cannot remain for You at all times, can it? ‘You’ still have to clear all those [‘files’], right? ‘You’ still have to bring an ultimate closure to everything, right? As for Dada, ultimate closure has mostly come about. Within this body, ‘I’ [the Gnani Purush]am established firmly in swakshetra alone. On top of that, the ‘drama’ is also being enacted [in the external part] all day long, whereas within, ‘I’ am firmly established in My own realm, that of the Self.

To maintain complete awareness as to what the Self is and what the non-Self is, and to ensure that You do not enter [the realm of] the non-Self, that exactly is adeethh tapa. This path is actually that of maintaining a line of demarcation between the Self and the non-Self. Out there, people are not even aware of the demarcation between the Self and the non-Self!

From the State as the Purush, Purusharth and Parakram Begin

So now, if any suffocation arises, then Know that You have come out of swakshetra and have stuck Your hand in parkshetra. So You should immediately say, ‘This is not My Real form as the Self.’ Upon saying that, the suffocation will come to an end.

Questioner: Upon saying, ‘This does not belong to Me,’ the suffocation will end.

Dadashri: Yes. [Understand this much,] ‘This [suffocation] does not belong to Me. This is not actually in My swaroop, and this [suffocation] that is there, that is not My swaroop. There is no such thing like complications in My swaroop; My swaroop is to be eternally blissful, whereby not even the slightest of miseries of worldly life ever come into the picture.’ So after having come into the state as the Purush, Your Purusharth should be of this kind. For you, before Gnan, the developing I (hu) was established in parkshetra and had taken on parsatta (the authority of the non-Self). Now, after Gnan, that developing ‘I’ has become established in swakshetra and has come into swasatta (the authority of the Self). So now, Purusharth and parakram can begin.

The State as the Knower-Seer in Swakshetra Is Actual Purusharth

There is only the function of Seeing and Knowing within One’s own pradesh (the smallest amount of space that a single Parmanu occupies on the Self) [as the Self]. There is nothing else at all. There is Parmatmapanu (the function as the absolute Self)! The moment One strays away from the function of Knowing and Seeing, there is trouble!

‘One’ has to come into ‘exactness’. In that, the Real is also correct and the relative is also correct. The relative is in the form of an object to be Known and the Real is in the form of the Knower. When the relationship of gneya and Gnata comes about, that itself is exactness. In exactness, liberation can be experienced right here whilst living.

Whether the other person presents you with a garland or curses at you, with respect to exactness, they are both gneya. Therefore, nothing at all affects the One in exactness.

Now, this whole world is in the form of gneya and You are the Gnata. The Gnayakswabhaav (the inherent nature of being the continuous Knower) has arisen for You. So now what remains?Once the Gnayakswabhaav has arisen, all You have to do is keep Seeing the gneya!

Once the Self becomes the Knower-Seer, it becomes the natural Self (sahajatmaAtma). It does not interfere in anything. The Purusharth of prevailing as the Knower-Seer is at a completely different level, isn’t it!

In the Function as the Knower-Seer, the Self Remains Separate

What is the meaning of Gnata-Drashta? The ultimate meaning is that One Knows and Sees all that is going on within; what the mind, intellect, chit, and ego are doing from all aspects. That is all, nothing else.And what state do You need to attain? The state where You can See Chandubhai moving around. When Chandubhai is moving around, if You sit and Seehim, then You will be able to See Chandubhai at that moment. ‘You’ should be able to See Chandubhai’s entire body and how he moved about. ‘You’ should be able to See the external part; the internal part will take longer. When the external part is Seen as separate, One begins to become vitaraag, and then He can become completely vitaraag.

Now, what is meant by the external part? Suppose your son is passing by and money is falling out of his pocket. Then what would you do in the past? You would make a fuss and get upset, “Hey, wait! Money is falling [out of your pocket], wait!” Everything would become disturbed from within. This is because you were ‘alive’; you were ‘alive’ as Chandubhai. So that happens only whilst you are ‘alive’ [as Chandubhai]. After attaining Gnan, You became the pure Soul, meaning You became the Knower-Seer, so when money falls out or anything else happens, you may alert him, “Son, money is falling out of your pocket.” ‘You’ should not have khench (a subtle pull of insistence) for it. The money falling is considered discharge, and for You to not have khench and to maintain jagruti, that is Purusharth indeed.

However, You can tell him, just as I tell you, “This is how you should run your motel.”But in ‘our’ case, there is no khench, nor do attachment or abhorrence arise. There is no khench whatsoever! ‘We’ do not believe ‘I am right’ by any means. What is right is right; it is not that what ‘we’ say is right, but whatever happens is correct! Then ‘we’ do not become disturbed by it. Even if ‘we’ do not alert him, there is no problem. It should not be apparent that ‘we’ are ‘alive’.

This vision will gradually start to increase. If the ego were ‘alive’ today, it would start creating disturbance within. Now whatever mistake or harm is going to happen will happen, You should remain the Knower-Seer. What would You do if you [the body] were dead? What if mistakes were made then? That is how You have to look at all this! If your daughter drops all the glassware and it breaks, then You are the Knower-Seer. That is all! Do not even say a word; live as though You are dead.

Questioner: Dada, in a very short time, you have given us the ultimate state of Krupaludev [i.e. Shrimad Rajchandra, Gnani Purush of the Kramik path]!

Dadashri: Yes, then there will be salvation; that is best. The ultimate state as the Knower-Seer is actually when Chandubhai is coming or going and You See that [with separation], ‘Oh wow! Welcome Chandubhai.’ When Chandubhai is talking, even then You See him as separate. WhenChandubhai is massaging Dada’s feet with oil, You See that. And when You say, ‘Chandubhai, you gave a good massage’; that is the ultimate!

Questioner: Is it Seen as a separate physical form or separate through understanding?

Dadashri: Initially, You See him as being separate through understanding (samajan), then gradually You will See him as physically separate. ‘You’ will See him walking around, just as you see someone else walking around. This man that you see coming and going, do you see him through your understanding?

Questioner: No, physically.

Dadashri: When You See like that, that is the function of Knowing-Seeing. Therefore, the Self is separate.Do not have too much allurement for it. That is in fact considered a very high state. In Your case, if the state You have been given becomes firmly established, then that is more than enough. If You try to set a limit, then You will miss out on this, as well as the other.

Questioner: You said that Chandubhai should appear separate, walking around, that there should be that much separation, but in that, the Seer resides within Chandubhai, doesn’t He?

Dadashri: That is exactly when You have to See, isn’t it! Despite residing within Chandubhai, You can See Chandubhai as being separate. That too is the ultimate state. For You, it is more than enough if You attain the state that I have mentioned. Once You reach that ‘station’, all the other ‘stations’ will arrive.

Upon Realizing Who You Are, Eternal Bliss Prevails

The result of Knowing and Seeing is bliss. On one side, You become the Knower-Seer and on the other side, bliss arises; that is how it is. Take, for example, when a person goes to a movie theatre, he becomes perplexed if the curtains do not get lifted up, so he starts whistling and yelling. Why does he do that? It’s because it bothers him; he came to see [the movie], but he is not able to see it. Happiness does not arise in him until he sees the gneya [the movie]. Similarly, the Self Sees and Knows the gneya and eternal bliss (parmanand) arises.

Questioner: Who prevails in eternal bliss? Do ‘I’ prevail in eternal bliss or is it the Parmatma (absolute Self)?

Dadashri: No, it is verily You Yourself; the ‘I’ itself. Not the I who is Chandubhai; ‘I am Chandubhai’ is from the relative viewpoint. ‘You’ should attain the bhaan (experiential awareness) that ‘I am the pure Self.’ ‘You’ should attain the experiential awareness of who You really are.

Questioner: Does the original Self (Chetan)need to prevail in eternal bliss?

Dadashri: No, the inherent nature of the original Self is verily that of eternal bliss; eternal blissis inherently present within it. The original Self does not need [to make efforts] to stay in eternal bliss. [The property of] Eternal blissis there inherently in the original Self.It is just because You [the developing ‘I’] have become Chandubhai that You are now looking for eternal bliss. The reason for that is You [as Chandubhai] do not have eternal bliss.

Eternal Bliss Arises in the State as the Knower-Seer

Questioner: Which state can we refer to as the state of eternal bliss? There has to be some description of that state, right?

Dadashri: Say the sun is present but you cannot directly see it, nonetheless, you can see its illumination down here. The clouds are thin, so the illumination comes through slightly. That is the kind of bliss that You are experiencing right now; and when there are no ‘clouds’ [veils of ignorance over the Self], and You come into Your inherent nature as the Self in exactness, then eternal bliss will prevail.

Questioner: How can we go towards that state of eternal bliss?

Dadashri: When the intellect is not used and You prevail as the Knower-Seer, then eternal bliss will certainly prevail. And the experience of that eternal bliss, that itself is the experience as the Self. If it [the intellect] does not interfere, then You can prevail as the Knower-Seer and the very result of that is eternal bliss. The inherent nature of the pure Soul is to be the Gnayak (the continuous Knower). What is the result of coming into that inherent nature? Eternal bliss! Sugar does not need to be crushed into a powdered form to be added to tea because its inherent nature is to melt in water. Likewise, the inherent nature of the Self is that of the Knower-Seer and eternal bliss. The Self always remains within its intrinsic functional properties (gunadharma)!

‘We’ are actually someone who has been free from interference from the start! As ‘we’ have become free from interference, even if people sitting around ‘us’ interfere, how can that affect ‘us’? All the interference goes away simply by ‘our’ presence. What problem could arise for the One who only dwells in the Self? Worldly life does not obstruct the One who dwells only in the Self.

When the body [conduct that is visible through the five senses] becomes well-behaved, that is known as vyavahaar charitra (worldly conduct). When the Self becomes ‘well-behaved’ [remains within its inherent nature,] that is known as Nishchay Charitra (Conduct as the Self). When the Self becomes ‘well-behaved’, it is known as the Knower-Seer. It remains only in eternal bliss. It does not get involved in anything else. Conduct as the Self (Atma charitra) means to prevail as the Knower-Seer and in eternal bliss.

What does the term ‘undiscovered miracle’ mean to convey? It is conveying that this eternal bliss is verily within You. Just look at this ruckus that You have kicked up to seek it out, yet You are unable to find it [though it is lying hidden within You]. This is the ‘undiscovered miracle’. ‘Your’ spiritual work will be done if it is found!

~ Jai Sat Chit Anand

Nothing Needs to Be Done, One Simply Needs to See

Questioner: But say there is some other person, file number ten, I should not see him at fault. Should ‘I’ See him as flawless?

Dadashri: [Yes, he is] Flawless! Hey, even Your ‘file’ number two [spouse] is flawless! This is because what was the original offense? It was that you saw everyone else to be at fault, and you did not see Chandubhai’s faults. This is the reaction of that offense. So the culprit has been caught. There are no other culprits at all.

Questioner: Initially all the wrong things were seen.

Dadashri: Nothing but the wrong things were Seen, now You are Seeing it correctly. This point simply needs to be understood. Nothing needs to be ‘done’. The concepts of the vitaraag Lords simply need to be understood, not to be ‘done’. The vitaraag Lords were so wise! If things had to be ‘done’, then the poor fellow would become exhausted!

Questioner: And if he were to ‘do’, then he would come into bondage once again, wouldn’t he?

Dadashri: Yes, to ‘do’ is itself bondage! To ‘do’ anything at all is bondage. To turn the rosary beads, to say, “I did it,” leads to bondage. But that is not for everyone. ‘We’ tell others [those who are not Self-realized], “Turn the rosary beads.” This is because that is their pursuit. The pursuits of both [those who are Self-realized and those who are not] are different.

Questioner: ‘I’ am beginning to See my own prakruti, ‘I’ can See everything; ‘I’ can See all of them, the mind, the intellect, the chit, and the ego, but how can ‘I’ study it? How should the Gnan work in the face of it? What kind of jagruti should prevail?

Dadashri: ‘You’ will definitely come to Know your own prakruti. ‘You’ will no doubt come to Know about the prakruti that, ‘This prakruti is definitely like this.’ And if You don’t Know as much about it now, then day by day, Your understanding of it will increase! But eventually, it will come into Your understanding completely. So all You have to do is simply keep Seeing what Chandubhai is doing, that itself is shuddhaupayog (pure applied awareness as the Self).

Questioner: We are supposed to keep Seeing our prakruti, however, we are not able to See it, moreover, we lapse in Seeing it, so what factor is at work there?

Dadashri: The avaran (veils of ignorance over the Knowledge of the Self). The avaran actuallyneed to be broken.

Questioner: How can they be broken?

Dadashri: Through the vidhis (special inner energies attained from the Gnani) done over here [in satsang]; day by day, the avaran start to break, and in turn You will be able to See. Initially, you were covered fully with the avaran only, you were not able to See anything. Now, You are able to See to some extent. It is the avaran that prevents You from Seeing everything. Right now, You cannot See all of your own faults. How many can You See? Can You See ten to fifteen of them?

Questioner: ‘I’ can See many of them.

Dadashri: A hundred or so?

Questioner: A chain [of Seeing them] carries on.

Dadashri: Even then, not all of them are Seen. There is some avaran still remaining. There are many faults. Even for ‘us’, while doing vidhis, the faults at
the subtler and subtlest levels continue to happen; the kind that do not harm the other person, however, ‘we’ are aware that such faults are taking place. ‘We’ have to cleanse them immediately. It would not do otherwise! However many are Seen, those many must be cleansed.

Clean Your Own Wheat Grains

Questioner: If one has a habit of only seeing the prakruti of others, then what is that considered?

Dadashri: If you want to see the prakruti of others, then you should not point out their faults. You can understand, ‘This is a fault,’ but you should not point it out to
him. He has learned to See his own faults, so is there any need for you to point them out to him?

Questioner: No, but if he points out my faults, then what should I do?

Dadashri: When he points out your faults and if you retaliate by pointing out his faults, then the situation will progressively worsen. Instead, if you stop pointing out his mistakes, then someday he will have the thought, ‘He is not getting tired of this. I’m the only one who’s getting tired here.’ So he will grow wary of it and put a stop to it. Pointing out the faults of others is a waste of time. You have endless faults within, yet you are seeing the faults of others. Hey, why don’t you ‘clean’ your own ‘wheat grains’! You are ‘cleaning’ the ‘wheat grains’ of others, while milling the ‘grains’ of your own home without having ‘cleaned’ them first!

Questioner: But Dada, sometimes it’s the case that our own ‘wheat grains’ have been ‘cleaned’, but then while we are ‘cleaning’ them, whoever we are interacting with comes and mixes his unsorted ‘wheat grains’ in our sorted pile. And we request him, “Dear fellow, don’t do this.”

Dadashri: When would he add unsorted ones to your sorted pile? He will only add them if your own are unsorted. If they have been ‘cleaned’ [properly], then he would not do so. That is the rule.

(From Param Pujya Dadashri’s Gnanvani)